WEBVTT 00:00:04.980 --> 00:00:07.321 You can find all the episodes of 00:00:07.321 --> 00:00:08.081 this podcast in the 00:00:08.081 --> 00:00:10.101 ARD audio library and everywhere 00:00:10.101 --> 00:00:11.700 there are podcasts. 00:00:13.180 --> 00:00:14.621 A city somewhere in 00:00:14.621 --> 00:00:17.160 Germany, 2022. 00:00:17.560 --> 00:00:19.300 Reading is over. 00:00:19.900 --> 00:00:20.961 I failed and I 00:00:20.961 --> 00:00:22.260 gave up. 00:00:22.260 --> 00:00:24.381 I felt battled 00:00:24.381 --> 00:00:28.501 about it and 00:00:28.501 --> 00:00:29.520 felt I did everything 00:00:29.520 --> 00:00:30.921 in my power and 00:00:30.921 --> 00:00:32.001 I fell on the 00:00:32.001 --> 00:00:33.600 frets. 00:00:34.760 --> 00:00:35.921 Read has not gathered 00:00:35.921 --> 00:00:38.500 the money for the herbs. 00:00:38.680 --> 00:00:40.081 She still has the words from 00:00:40.081 --> 00:00:42.220 the herb letter in her head. 00:00:42.320 --> 00:00:43.221 Whoever cannot afford the 00:00:43.221 --> 00:00:44.160 herbs, let him 00:00:44.160 --> 00:00:45.821 show lack of will, let him 00:00:45.821 --> 00:00:47.500 break the holy oath. 00:00:47.900 --> 00:00:49.221 I would know this as such 00:00:49.221 --> 00:00:50.800 a kind of test, 00:00:50.800 --> 00:00:52.140 such a ultimate test. 00:00:52.140 --> 00:00:54.020 You get the gold ticket, you 00:00:54.020 --> 00:00:55.701 get the gold invitation. 00:00:55.701 --> 00:00:58.121 Now please go very consciously 00:00:58.121 --> 00:00:59.941 and very carefully with 00:00:59.941 --> 00:01:01.441 this introduction. 00:01:02.460 --> 00:01:04.241 Read is sure that she 00:01:04.241 --> 00:01:05.601 must dedicate herself even 00:01:05.601 --> 00:01:07.920 more to life in yoga school. 00:01:08.120 --> 00:01:09.501 It is the ashram of the 00:01:09.501 --> 00:01:10.761 German Academy of Traditional 00:01:10.761 --> 00:01:14.140 Yoga. But how? 00:01:14.560 --> 00:01:15.761 Because I also noticed 00:01:15.761 --> 00:01:16.481 that many people who have 00:01:16.481 --> 00:01:18.640 already lived in Ashram, that they 00:01:18.640 --> 00:01:20.141 simply resigned their 00:01:20.141 --> 00:01:21.381 apartment and then allowed 00:01:21.381 --> 00:01:22.641 them to move to 00:01:22.641 --> 00:01:23.300 Ashram. 00:01:23.300 --> 00:01:25.420 It was like an entrance ticket. 00:01:26.570 --> 00:01:29.811 That is it. Before she sits homeless on 00:01:29.811 --> 00:01:31.271 the street, they will already 00:01:31.271 --> 00:01:33.330 take her up, Liz thinks. 00:01:33.870 --> 00:01:35.111 She wrote a letter 00:01:35.111 --> 00:01:36.611 to Greg. 00:01:36.930 --> 00:01:38.351 I ask for permission to 00:01:38.351 --> 00:01:39.910 live in Ashram. 00:01:40.510 --> 00:01:42.650 She puts bikini photos. 00:01:43.010 --> 00:01:44.171 She wrote a letter 00:01:44.171 --> 00:01:46.370 to her owner. 00:01:46.990 --> 00:01:48.870 Read her apartment. 00:01:48.870 --> 00:01:50.471 This is now my proof of 00:01:50.471 --> 00:01:51.991 my loyalty to the group and 00:01:51.991 --> 00:01:53.731 to the faith and to the Guru. 00:01:53.731 --> 00:01:56.131 He will see that, it was like a complete 00:01:56.131 --> 00:01:57.570 sacrifice to be able 00:01:57.570 --> 00:01:59.470 to belong to it. 00:02:00.610 --> 00:02:02.151 Will this resignation be your 00:02:02.151 --> 00:02:04.050 ticket to the Ashram? 00:02:04.050 --> 00:02:06.030 The end of his old life? 00:02:14.430 --> 00:02:16.830 This is a soul captain. 00:02:17.370 --> 00:02:19.870 Season 4 – Toxic Tantra. 00:02:20.710 --> 00:02:22.271 A podcast by Christiane Havranek 00:02:22.271 --> 00:02:23.410 and me, Katja 00:02:23.410 --> 00:02:25.710 Peisen-Petersen. 00:02:27.670 --> 00:02:30.330 8 of therapy. 00:02:33.110 --> 00:02:35.051 When Liz wants to pull in 00:02:35.051 --> 00:02:36.571 these ashrugs of the German 00:02:36.571 --> 00:02:38.670 Academy for Traditional Yoga, 00:02:38.670 --> 00:02:39.711 a person from outside 00:02:39.711 --> 00:02:41.370 also gets that. 00:02:41.370 --> 00:02:43.530 And she wants to prevent it. 00:02:43.610 --> 00:02:45.430 Read the therapist. 00:02:45.430 --> 00:02:46.951 She plays a major role 00:02:46.951 --> 00:02:48.330 in Liz history. 00:02:48.330 --> 00:02:49.870 Because she was always there. 00:02:49.870 --> 00:02:50.831 At first she told 00:02:50.831 --> 00:02:51.810 me that. 00:02:51.810 --> 00:02:52.651 I thought it would be 00:02:52.651 --> 00:02:54.070 a normal yoga school. 00:02:54.070 --> 00:02:54.731 I was not worried 00:02:54.731 --> 00:02:56.130 at all. 00:02:56.130 --> 00:02:58.750 That is she. Amelia is warning. 00:02:59.010 --> 00:03:00.231 Christiane meets her at dinner 00:03:00.231 --> 00:03:01.771 in the kitchen of her practice, 00:03:01.771 --> 00:03:03.711 after a full day of therapy 00:03:03.711 --> 00:03:05.450 conversations. 00:03:05.910 --> 00:03:06.991 Liz has released her from 00:03:06.991 --> 00:03:08.571 her medical duty to keep silent 00:03:08.571 --> 00:03:10.410 for this conversation, in reference 00:03:10.410 --> 00:03:11.791 to the experience in the 00:03:11.791 --> 00:03:12.850 yoga school. 00:03:12.850 --> 00:03:14.171 This still impresses 00:03:14.171 --> 00:03:15.951 me, as intelligence 00:03:15.951 --> 00:03:17.610 is so outcast. 00:03:17.610 --> 00:03:18.311 So that people who actually 00:03:18.311 --> 00:03:19.711 possess judgment and intelligence 00:03:19.711 --> 00:03:22.111 then get into such a 00:03:22.111 --> 00:03:23.311 situation that it is 00:03:23.311 --> 00:03:24.950 somehow lost. 00:03:27.840 --> 00:03:29.721 This was the case with 00:03:29.721 --> 00:03:31.741 Eve and Nathalie. It seems 00:03:31.741 --> 00:03:32.821 a bit like these wise 00:03:32.821 --> 00:03:33.681 women had 00:03:33.681 --> 00:03:35.221 put off the button for 00:03:35.221 --> 00:03:36.961 their common sense during 00:03:36.961 --> 00:03:38.441 their time at the yoga 00:03:38.441 --> 00:03:40.040 school. 00:03:41.840 --> 00:03:42.981 Have you ever thought when 00:03:42.981 --> 00:03:45.360 you listen to this podcast that I would 00:03:45.360 --> 00:03:47.240 never have done that? 00:03:47.680 --> 00:03:49.480 Would I look through that? 00:03:49.500 --> 00:03:50.601 Why didn’t she 00:03:50.601 --> 00:03:52.101 just say no? 00:03:53.620 --> 00:03:56.181 The psychotherapist says it 00:03:56.181 --> 00:03:57.881 can affect basically anyone. 00:03:57.881 --> 00:04:00.460 Because the emotion is stronger. 00:04:01.360 --> 00:04:02.741 Because sometimes you are at 00:04:02.741 --> 00:04:04.461 points in life where you’d rather 00:04:04.461 --> 00:04:06.021 follow your feelings than 00:04:06.021 --> 00:04:07.560 be reasonable. 00:04:07.840 --> 00:04:08.621 Maybe a bit 00:04:08.621 --> 00:04:10.121 like in love. 00:04:10.360 --> 00:04:11.841 When you ask it, the doubts 00:04:11.841 --> 00:04:13.061 and the irritation 00:04:13.061 --> 00:04:15.140 have always been there. 00:04:15.140 --> 00:04:16.501 And the observation of what 00:04:16.501 --> 00:04:18.341 is not true is then denied, 00:04:18.341 --> 00:04:19.881 because the attraction 00:04:19.881 --> 00:04:21.201 is greater and because 00:04:21.201 --> 00:04:22.281 there are always 00:04:22.281 --> 00:04:23.801 arguments that remove 00:04:23.801 --> 00:04:25.380 doubts. 00:04:25.800 --> 00:04:27.461 But Liz came out and 00:04:27.461 --> 00:04:29.581 her therapist played 00:04:29.581 --> 00:04:31.640 a crucial role in it. 00:04:32.140 --> 00:04:33.280 We want to know from her 00:04:33.280 --> 00:04:34.841 how she managed not to 00:04:34.841 --> 00:04:36.200 lose reading. 00:04:36.200 --> 00:04:37.081 I tried to hold them 00:04:37.081 --> 00:04:38.581 for myself. 00:04:38.680 --> 00:04:39.481 I didn’t put any pressure 00:04:39.481 --> 00:04:41.581 at all and then said if 00:04:41.581 --> 00:04:42.741 you don’t feel comfortable 00:04:42.741 --> 00:04:45.061 with me, then that’s okay, 00:04:45.061 --> 00:04:46.261 then you can report 00:04:46.261 --> 00:04:47.061 if you want to 00:04:47.061 --> 00:04:48.561 see me again. 00:04:48.980 --> 00:04:49.741 And we also had 00:04:49.741 --> 00:04:52.681 therapy breaks and I never 00:04:52.681 --> 00:04:53.961 followed them. 00:04:53.961 --> 00:04:54.881 She always came 00:04:54.881 --> 00:04:58.320 back by herself. 00:04:58.760 --> 00:05:00.061 If you know someone who is 00:05:00.061 --> 00:05:01.921 in a destructive group or someone 00:05:01.921 --> 00:05:03.320 who threatens to be dragged 00:05:03.320 --> 00:05:04.820 into, don’t try to 00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:06.061 speak against the group, 00:05:06.061 --> 00:05:08.520 advises Amelie Wanschafe. 00:05:08.520 --> 00:05:09.561 And I had to swallow it 00:05:09.561 --> 00:05:11.061 very well in the time of Corona, 00:05:11.061 --> 00:05:12.341 which I had all involved 00:05:12.341 --> 00:05:14.081 and discussed 00:05:14.081 --> 00:05:16.560 with so to speak. 00:05:17.100 --> 00:05:19.400 I had 00:05:20.280 --> 00:05:22.381 to control my 00:05:22.381 --> 00:05:23.481 own attitude 00:05:23.481 --> 00:05:25.141 or anger. 00:05:25.141 --> 00:05:26.641 00:05:28.890 --> 00:05:30.171 Liz has spoken of the apocalypse 00:05:30.171 --> 00:05:31.411 more often and at 00:05:31.411 --> 00:05:33.131 the same time has to 00:05:33.131 --> 00:05:34.451 be issued a certificate 00:05:34.451 --> 00:05:35.831 from a natural healing 00:05:35.831 --> 00:05:37.090 doctor to avoid 00:05:37.090 --> 00:05:39.410 wearing a mask. 00:05:40.230 --> 00:05:41.691 Her therapist often felt 00:05:41.691 --> 00:05:42.450 like he 00:05:42.450 --> 00:05:44.510 was fighting a beast. 00:05:44.510 --> 00:05:46.091 It is against what Liz apparently 00:05:46.091 --> 00:05:48.190 has internalized in the yoga school. 00:05:48.790 --> 00:05:50.870 What gave me superiority was, as 00:05:50.870 --> 00:05:54.390 it were, this non-requiring. 00:05:54.390 --> 00:05:57.411 And do not judge that I 00:05:57.411 --> 00:05:58.831 said, as long as it is good 00:05:58.831 --> 00:06:00.270 for you, then go there. 00:06:00.270 --> 00:06:01.990 You have to decide. 00:06:03.330 --> 00:06:04.451 This is different than in the 00:06:04.451 --> 00:06:06.211 yoga school, where Liz felt like 00:06:06.211 --> 00:06:07.871 he had to follow very precise 00:06:07.871 --> 00:06:09.371 statements. 00:06:10.050 --> 00:06:10.891 And I think that has helped 00:06:10.891 --> 00:06:12.431 a lot to make her always 00:06:12.431 --> 00:06:13.531 notice the difference. 00:06:13.531 --> 00:06:15.110 00:06:15.110 --> 00:06:18.230 With me, she has a choice. 00:06:19.010 --> 00:06:20.371 A psychotherapist 00:06:20.371 --> 00:06:22.271 for relatives. 00:06:22.271 --> 00:06:25.690 offer to you. Have an open ear. 00:06:25.690 --> 00:06:27.910 And most importantly, do not judge. 00:06:28.190 --> 00:06:29.511 Because if your loved ones come 00:06:29.511 --> 00:06:31.150 into doubt at some point, then 00:06:31.190 --> 00:06:33.470 there is someone from the old world. 00:06:33.570 --> 00:06:35.730 Someone you can turn to. 00:06:36.090 --> 00:06:37.990 That person is you. 00:06:39.710 --> 00:06:42.150 The therapist did not judge. 00:06:42.150 --> 00:06:43.730 almost 3 years. 00:06:43.970 --> 00:06:45.550 But there were situations, she 00:06:45.550 --> 00:06:47.250 had to say something. 00:06:47.670 --> 00:06:48.751 When she read about the 00:06:48.751 --> 00:06:51.050 bikini photos, for example. 00:06:51.390 --> 00:06:53.090 I was then convinced that 00:06:53.090 --> 00:06:53.971 this was a highly 00:06:53.971 --> 00:06:55.371 abusive structure and that 00:06:55.371 --> 00:06:57.190 it was dangerous. 00:06:57.690 --> 00:06:58.691 I have already taken 00:06:58.691 --> 00:07:00.790 a clear position. 00:07:00.790 --> 00:07:01.651 And I would now believe 00:07:01.651 --> 00:07:02.751 I also recommend relatives 00:07:02.751 --> 00:07:04.131 that if you get 00:07:04.131 --> 00:07:05.471 told real border 00:07:05.471 --> 00:07:07.150 crossing, so to speak, 00:07:07.150 --> 00:07:08.511 that you can also 00:07:08.511 --> 00:07:10.371 say, it can not 00:07:10.371 --> 00:07:11.670 be. 00:07:11.670 --> 00:07:12.331 Nothing can justify 00:07:12.331 --> 00:07:14.050 that in any way. 00:07:14.390 --> 00:07:16.531 Amelie Warning knew, since it 00:07:16.531 --> 00:07:18.451 was buried somewhere under the 00:07:18.451 --> 00:07:20.371 theories of demons, angels 00:07:20.371 --> 00:07:23.090 and guru, read inner voice. 00:07:23.150 --> 00:07:24.690 She wanted to strengthen her. 00:07:24.690 --> 00:07:26.511 I recommended her 00:07:26.511 --> 00:07:27.930 to inform. 00:07:27.930 --> 00:07:29.151 That I explained to her again 00:07:29.151 --> 00:07:31.351 how to check facts and 00:07:31.351 --> 00:07:34.490 what serious press organs are. 00:07:34.490 --> 00:07:35.811 And then she actually 00:07:35.811 --> 00:07:36.830 did it. 00:07:36.830 --> 00:07:37.871 And then, at some point, I 00:07:37.871 --> 00:07:38.931 think, she has come across 00:07:38.931 --> 00:07:39.771 a document or an article 00:07:39.771 --> 00:07:42.131 about conspiracy theories. 00:07:42.131 --> 00:07:44.011 And that, I think, the article 00:07:44.011 --> 00:07:46.030 was even the turning point. 00:07:48.940 --> 00:07:50.441 The whole thing takes place around 00:07:50.441 --> 00:07:52.101 the time Liz wants to move 00:07:52.101 --> 00:07:53.480 into the aschram. 00:07:53.480 --> 00:07:55.321 In fact, she has the desire 00:07:55.321 --> 00:07:57.340 for complete devotion. 00:07:57.340 --> 00:07:58.561 On the other hand, the 00:07:58.561 --> 00:08:00.780 doubts are growing. 00:08:01.280 --> 00:08:02.421 And now we are at the point 00:08:02.421 --> 00:08:04.081 in Liz history that decides 00:08:04.081 --> 00:08:05.640 everything. 00:08:05.660 --> 00:08:06.921 Liz talks to her therapist 00:08:06.921 --> 00:08:09.340 about her dissent. 00:08:09.460 --> 00:08:11.061 She confides to her that she has 00:08:11.061 --> 00:08:12.520 resigned her apartment. 00:08:12.520 --> 00:08:14.601 But then, with the help 00:08:14.601 --> 00:08:15.661 of my therapist, I somehow 00:08:15.661 --> 00:08:16.801 got back in touch with 00:08:16.801 --> 00:08:17.901 my mind and it was so, okay, 00:08:17.901 --> 00:08:19.341 we are now saving 00:08:19.341 --> 00:08:20.841 my apartment. 00:08:22.840 --> 00:08:25.040 It will read out. 00:08:25.040 --> 00:08:26.361 My therapist helped me 00:08:26.361 --> 00:08:28.261 once again to turn the 00:08:28.261 --> 00:08:29.701 wheel and somehow reverse 00:08:29.701 --> 00:08:31.021 it with the help 00:08:31.021 --> 00:08:31.960 of a lawyer. 00:08:31.960 --> 00:08:33.061 And that was really mega- 00:08:33.061 --> 00:08:34.041 stressing, it was a week- 00:08:34.041 --> 00:08:36.120 long stress without end. 00:08:36.120 --> 00:08:36.601 We managed to 00:08:36.601 --> 00:08:38.900 save the apartment. 00:08:38.900 --> 00:08:40.660 Read not into the ashram. 00:08:40.660 --> 00:08:42.401 I think if that had happened, 00:08:42.401 --> 00:08:43.420 I don’t know I would 00:08:43.420 --> 00:08:45.060 be gone now. 00:08:46.300 --> 00:08:48.940 Read landed hard in her old life. 00:08:49.560 --> 00:08:51.200 She has no friends, no fixed 00:08:51.200 --> 00:08:52.640 job, no money, and 00:08:52.640 --> 00:08:54.361 she is completely unsure 00:08:54.361 --> 00:08:56.161 of what is right and what 00:08:56.161 --> 00:09:02.411 is wrong. While Liz is about to 00:09:02.411 --> 00:09:03.731 leave the yoga school, 00:09:03.731 --> 00:09:05.911 Natalie is still in 00:09:05.911 --> 00:09:07.430 the middle. 00:09:07.610 --> 00:09:10.051 In April 2022 she will 00:09:10.051 --> 00:09:12.470 go to Paris for the second time, 00:09:12.550 --> 00:09:13.810 to her Guru. 00:09:13.810 --> 00:09:15.710 This time it was super full. 00:09:15.710 --> 00:09:18.011 Seven other girls were 00:09:18.011 --> 00:09:19.910 there with me. 00:09:21.170 --> 00:09:22.711 They are all in the 00:09:22.711 --> 00:09:24.870 room with the books. 00:09:25.010 --> 00:09:26.231 There they hear voices from 00:09:26.231 --> 00:09:27.731 Bivolarus room. 00:09:27.990 --> 00:09:29.130 So she remembers. 00:09:29.130 --> 00:09:30.451 He was with another girl 00:09:30.451 --> 00:09:31.930 in the room. 00:09:31.930 --> 00:09:33.471 Suddenly he starts to completely 00:09:33.471 --> 00:09:35.051 cling them together and 00:09:35.051 --> 00:09:36.790 scream at them. 00:09:36.790 --> 00:09:38.611 Soon after, the woman comes 00:09:38.611 --> 00:09:39.231 in. 00:09:39.231 --> 00:09:41.491 She tells me that Bivularo 00:09:41.491 --> 00:09:42.690 sent her away. 00:09:42.690 --> 00:09:44.471 He said your stomach needs to get 00:09:44.471 --> 00:09:47.510 smaller, otherwise it won’t be possible. 00:09:47.610 --> 00:09:48.891 Nathalie gets even more often to 00:09:48.891 --> 00:09:50.770 know that Bivularo becomes loud. 00:09:50.770 --> 00:09:51.850 When we do something wrong, it 00:09:51.850 --> 00:09:53.090 completely disappears. 00:09:53.090 --> 00:09:54.931 If she is in his room, 00:09:54.931 --> 00:09:56.770 she must work, Nathalie 00:09:56.770 --> 00:09:58.190 thinks. 00:09:58.190 --> 00:09:59.571 She has to have different 00:09:59.571 --> 00:10:01.610 sex positions. 00:10:01.610 --> 00:10:03.630 Because they are always the same. 00:10:03.990 --> 00:10:05.151 Bivularo explains it only 00:10:05.151 --> 00:10:07.050 once in the initiation. 00:10:07.050 --> 00:10:09.091 Not in the next meetings. 00:10:09.091 --> 00:10:10.591 00:10:10.690 --> 00:10:11.651 If you don’t do that, 00:10:11.651 --> 00:10:13.670 there are problems. 00:10:13.670 --> 00:10:14.790 Following the motto, oh my God, 00:10:14.790 --> 00:10:17.910 you are not focused and so on. 00:10:18.410 --> 00:10:19.791 But that’s why often when 00:10:19.791 --> 00:10:22.330 we were there with other girls, we 00:10:22.570 --> 00:10:23.991 were still practicing 00:10:23.991 --> 00:10:26.170 in our room. 00:10:26.330 --> 00:10:27.531 Okay, how do we now move from 00:10:27.531 --> 00:10:29.390 one position to another? 00:10:29.390 --> 00:10:32.290 foot here and foot there. 00:10:32.490 --> 00:10:34.690 So that we do not do anything wrong. 00:10:34.690 --> 00:10:36.331 So that he doesn’t 00:10:36.331 --> 00:10:37.371 get us together 00:10:37.371 --> 00:10:38.871 in any way. 00:10:38.930 --> 00:10:40.311 Nathalie does not question 00:10:40.311 --> 00:10:41.770 this behavior. 00:10:41.770 --> 00:10:43.830 She knows why he is so. 00:10:44.130 --> 00:10:45.691 If he screams at you, he will 00:10:45.691 --> 00:10:47.191 do you something good. 00:10:47.410 --> 00:10:48.890 So, when he screams at you, 00:10:48.890 --> 00:10:50.930 he practically breaks your ego. 00:10:50.930 --> 00:10:52.051 So spiritually, you 00:10:52.051 --> 00:10:53.731 passed your test and that’ 00:10:53.731 --> 00:10:55.231 s all great. 00:10:57.810 --> 00:10:59.251 At this visit her Guru 00:10:59.251 --> 00:11:01.150 is pleased with her. 00:11:01.150 --> 00:11:02.971 But then, at the next meeting, 00:11:02.971 --> 00:11:06.990 in June 2022, it will happen. 00:11:06.990 --> 00:11:09.111 There was your body, it 00:11:09.111 --> 00:11:12.430 just didn’t play anymore. 00:11:12.630 --> 00:11:14.130 It did not go. 00:11:14.450 --> 00:11:16.051 Nathalie can no longer 00:11:16.051 --> 00:11:18.510 have sex with the old man. 00:11:18.770 --> 00:11:19.671 The moment I stopped 00:11:19.671 --> 00:11:21.151 at the door, he was still 00:11:21.151 --> 00:11:22.290 there, yes, if that happens 00:11:22.290 --> 00:11:22.851 again, you have 00:11:22.851 --> 00:11:23.571 to shave your 00:11:23.571 --> 00:11:25.490 head. 00:11:25.490 --> 00:11:27.210 Rice the head. 00:11:27.450 --> 00:11:28.591 Nathalie has seen this repeatedly, 00:11:28.591 --> 00:11:30.810 before in Bucharest. 00:11:30.810 --> 00:11:32.650 Women with glitter. 00:11:32.670 --> 00:11:35.010 Repentance for the mistakes made. 00:11:35.010 --> 00:11:37.431 Many, many girls do this 00:11:37.431 --> 00:11:38.511 in school, so get threatened 00:11:38.511 --> 00:11:39.831 and then get through 00:11:39.831 --> 00:11:41.331 it. 00:11:41.410 --> 00:11:42.151 Some do this voluntarily, 00:11:42.151 --> 00:11:43.391 because there is a 00:11:43.391 --> 00:11:44.291 spiritual thought 00:11:44.291 --> 00:11:45.211 behind it, but 00:11:45.211 --> 00:11:47.291 it is so normal in 00:11:47.291 --> 00:11:48.550 school. 00:11:48.550 --> 00:11:50.031 Other women have told 00:11:50.031 --> 00:11:51.770 us about it too. 00:11:51.770 --> 00:11:53.491 And also that Bivoularo is constantly 00:11:53.491 --> 00:11:55.150 ripping out. 00:11:55.590 --> 00:11:58.270 Will Nathalie soon wear a gloss? 00:11:58.390 --> 00:12:00.330 The long brown hair? 00:12:00.770 --> 00:12:02.710 Never, she thinks it is. 00:12:03.250 --> 00:12:04.951 She is driving back to the 00:12:04.951 --> 00:12:07.850 first house, to the waiting women. 00:12:07.890 --> 00:12:08.671 I also had a very 00:12:08.671 --> 00:12:10.371 bad emotional 00:12:10.371 --> 00:12:12.170 reaction. 00:12:12.170 --> 00:12:14.091 After 24 hours I was 00:12:14.091 --> 00:12:14.810 crying. 00:12:14.810 --> 00:12:16.610 I couldn’t stop it either. 00:12:16.610 --> 00:12:18.330 My body was completely over. 00:12:18.330 --> 00:12:20.491 Where all the girls were, that 00:12:20.491 --> 00:12:22.250 is all purification. 00:12:22.430 --> 00:12:23.630 Everything comes out, then everything 00:12:23.630 --> 00:12:24.691 comes out, then everything 00:12:24.691 --> 00:12:25.410 is fine. 00:12:25.410 --> 00:12:26.891 Then you come back, then everything 00:12:26.891 --> 00:12:28.310 is better. 00:12:28.310 --> 00:12:30.591 I was there, I will 00:12:30.591 --> 00:12:31.631 definitely not come back. 00:12:31.631 --> 00:12:32.311 I did not say that, 00:12:32.311 --> 00:12:34.110 but I thought. 00:12:35.270 --> 00:12:37.710 Nathalie is flying back to Bucharest. 00:12:37.970 --> 00:12:39.470 With Jasper. 00:12:40.240 --> 00:12:41.760 Then I told him everything. 00:12:41.760 --> 00:12:43.441 I was then, I was always 00:12:43.441 --> 00:12:44.420 there, this 00:12:44.420 --> 00:12:45.561 was the last time, 00:12:45.561 --> 00:12:46.921 and it’s all 00:12:46.921 --> 00:12:48.421 terrible. 00:12:49.640 --> 00:12:51.301 When Nathalie Jasper reveals 00:12:51.301 --> 00:12:52.100 all this, 00:12:52.100 --> 00:12:54.920 she can only think of one thing. 00:12:55.460 --> 00:12:56.960 Holy fuck. 00:12:57.400 --> 00:12:58.900 That is how it told us. 00:13:00.130 --> 00:13:01.971 During his time at yoga 00:13:01.971 --> 00:13:04.790 school, he heard stories. 00:13:04.790 --> 00:13:07.211 Bivoularo is to initiate women spiritually 00:13:07.211 --> 00:13:08.011 in Paris. 00:13:08.011 --> 00:13:09.770 00:13:10.070 --> 00:13:12.010 But he did not learn more about it. 00:13:12.010 --> 00:13:14.230 It was always so strictly secret. 00:13:15.720 --> 00:13:17.381 Now that Nathalie tells him 00:13:17.381 --> 00:13:18.681 everything up to the smallest 00:13:18.681 --> 00:13:20.121 details, Jasper is 00:13:20.121 --> 00:13:24.540 just upset. And disgusted. 00:13:24.660 --> 00:13:27.841 by Bivoularo. Jasper starts to 00:13:27.841 --> 00:13:29.320 question everything. 00:13:29.320 --> 00:13:31.161 The story told them why 00:13:31.161 --> 00:13:32.941 Bivularo is hiding from 00:13:32.941 --> 00:13:34.720 the authorities. 00:13:34.860 --> 00:13:36.560 The teachings of the school. 00:13:37.240 --> 00:13:38.761 Jasper ends up with the 00:13:38.761 --> 00:13:40.141 other and he chooses 00:13:40.141 --> 00:13:41.641 for Natalie. 00:13:41.800 --> 00:13:43.261 And the two got off because they 00:13:43.261 --> 00:13:45.180 now question everything, even 00:13:45.180 --> 00:13:46.441 in conflict with their 00:13:46.441 --> 00:13:47.980 yoga teachers. 00:13:48.220 --> 00:13:50.100 And with her friends at school. 00:13:51.300 --> 00:13:52.721 You want to confront your 00:13:52.721 --> 00:13:55.000 guru with these doubts. 00:13:55.120 --> 00:13:56.261 Natalie writes an email 00:13:56.261 --> 00:13:58.081 to Gregoriam Bivularo. 00:13:58.081 --> 00:13:59.661 The address is without 00:13:59.661 --> 00:14:02.780 a clear name, with a Russian domain. 00:14:03.590 --> 00:14:04.551 There must be someone in the 00:14:04.551 --> 00:14:05.611 middle because his English is 00:14:05.611 --> 00:14:07.091 not good enough, so someone translates 00:14:07.091 --> 00:14:08.591 that there. 00:14:08.790 --> 00:14:09.811 But he has to read those 00:14:09.811 --> 00:14:12.310 emails because when I was 00:14:12.310 --> 00:14:13.131 there, he also talked 00:14:13.131 --> 00:14:14.811 to me about things I had 00:14:14.811 --> 00:14:16.370 sent him in letters. 00:14:17.150 --> 00:14:18.671 The failed meeting with Bivolaru 00:14:18.671 --> 00:14:20.411 does not mention her in this 00:14:20.411 --> 00:14:21.630 email. 00:14:21.630 --> 00:14:23.231 She talks about problems she 00:14:23.231 --> 00:14:24.671 has with some yoga teachers 00:14:24.671 --> 00:14:25.610 from school. 00:14:25.610 --> 00:14:27.371 She said that they did 00:14:27.371 --> 00:14:28.451 not act as models in 00:14:28.451 --> 00:14:29.670 her eyes. 00:14:29.670 --> 00:14:31.190 I wrote that to him, sorry, 00:14:31.190 --> 00:14:32.271 but when I look at people, 00:14:32.271 --> 00:14:32.791 I don’t want 00:14:32.791 --> 00:14:34.110 to stay in school. 00:14:34.110 --> 00:14:35.391 If school makes me into such 00:14:35.391 --> 00:14:38.090 a person, thank you, no. 00:14:38.310 --> 00:14:39.831 I was really super honest 00:14:39.831 --> 00:14:41.610 with what I 00:14:41.610 --> 00:14:43.371 felt like at the 00:14:43.371 --> 00:14:44.871 moment. 00:14:45.770 --> 00:14:47.211 It doesn’t take long and 00:14:47.211 --> 00:14:49.270 Nathalie gets a response. 00:14:49.270 --> 00:14:51.850 One email, several pages long. 00:14:51.870 --> 00:14:53.991 It is signed with the self 00:14:53.991 --> 00:14:55.491 same. 00:14:55.570 --> 00:14:57.091 The author writes in plural 00:14:57.091 --> 00:15:00.590 majestatis, i.e. in we-form. 00:15:01.230 --> 00:15:02.371 Natalie has to struggle through 00:15:02.371 --> 00:15:03.710 this mail, because 00:15:03.710 --> 00:15:04.651 everything is 00:15:04.651 --> 00:15:06.131 a bit tricky and 00:15:06.131 --> 00:15:08.170 swirling. 00:15:08.330 --> 00:15:10.630 Natalie reads about Jesus, 00:15:10.630 --> 00:15:13.290 Lucifer and the Apocalypse. 00:15:14.050 --> 00:15:16.331 The self-same attests to their 00:15:16.331 --> 00:15:18.710 psycho-emotional problems. 00:15:19.270 --> 00:15:20.851 She has not passed certain 00:15:20.851 --> 00:15:21.870 tests, is 00:15:21.870 --> 00:15:23.911 under the influence of demons. 00:15:23.911 --> 00:15:26.850 And you can do nothing more for them. 00:15:27.510 --> 00:15:28.950 It’s like roulette, they 00:15:28.950 --> 00:15:31.590 say. Rihanna is out. 00:15:34.810 --> 00:15:35.991 Jasper also reads the 00:15:35.991 --> 00:15:38.530 reply email from TheSelfSame. 00:15:38.670 --> 00:15:39.811 Both of them can’t 00:15:39.811 --> 00:15:41.870 believe what they read. 00:15:41.870 --> 00:15:42.951 Where he meant I had 00:15:42.951 --> 00:15:44.310 any psychological problems, there 00:15:44.310 --> 00:15:47.490 I was so, well, I didn’t. 00:15:48.190 --> 00:15:50.570 Both are now clear. 00:15:50.570 --> 00:15:52.311 Would he be a real teacher? 00:15:52.311 --> 00:15:55.611 So a spiritual guru or 00:15:55.611 --> 00:15:58.310 whatever, he would help me. 00:15:58.390 --> 00:15:59.611 Then he would say, okay rabbit, 00:15:59.611 --> 00:16:01.211 come, this and that and that 00:16:01.211 --> 00:16:01.951 and that you can do now and 00:16:01.951 --> 00:16:03.450 then you’ll get better. 00:16:03.450 --> 00:16:04.950 But he was not. 00:16:05.190 --> 00:16:07.591 He was caught in his fever, 00:16:07.591 --> 00:16:10.671 where he was completely 00:16:10.671 --> 00:16:12.390 out of the room. 00:16:13.190 --> 00:16:14.371 The two now want to know 00:16:14.371 --> 00:16:16.511 how their guru will react 00:16:16.511 --> 00:16:19.050 when he hears the truth? 00:16:19.710 --> 00:16:23.330 Nathalie wrote to him. 00:16:23.350 --> 00:16:26.150 It starts with the words Dear G. 00:16:37.470 --> 00:16:38.911 She writes to him that she 00:16:38.911 --> 00:16:40.151 was constantly afraid of 00:16:40.151 --> 00:16:42.171 doing something wrong with him 00:16:42.171 --> 00:16:44.030 and then being screamed. 00:16:49.350 --> 00:16:51.211 In my view, it is not 00:16:51.211 --> 00:16:52.871 yes if I am too afraid 00:16:52.871 --> 00:16:54.710 to say no. 00:16:56.920 --> 00:16:58.221 Natalie sends the email and 00:16:58.221 --> 00:17:00.360 waits. 00:17:01.110 --> 00:17:02.610 for a week. 00:17:04.970 --> 00:17:07.670 Then theSelfSame answers. 00:17:07.890 --> 00:17:09.011 Natalie should urgently 00:17:09.011 --> 00:17:10.951 try to fight the demonic 00:17:10.951 --> 00:17:13.850 states in her being. 00:17:14.210 --> 00:17:15.551 She was to name the names 00:17:15.551 --> 00:17:16.971 of the women who allegedly 00:17:16.971 --> 00:17:19.130 were afraid when meeting him. 00:17:19.250 --> 00:17:20.211 He never raised his 00:17:20.211 --> 00:17:21.990 voice or screamed. 00:17:21.990 --> 00:17:25.210 He sends a testimony to Natalie. 00:17:25.330 --> 00:17:26.571 A German man wrote 00:17:26.571 --> 00:17:28.810 it after meeting him. 00:17:28.950 --> 00:17:30.571 Even after a long time, 00:17:30.571 --> 00:17:33.470 she had no end to orgasms. 00:17:33.630 --> 00:17:35.950 It is a divine pleasure. 00:17:36.450 --> 00:17:38.591 He has more than 3,000 testimonies, 00:17:38.591 --> 00:17:40.330 according to the mail. 00:17:40.550 --> 00:17:42.071 Women who were apparently 00:17:42.071 --> 00:17:43.851 filmed after the initiation, 00:17:43.851 --> 00:17:45.511 recorded on tape, or 00:17:45.511 --> 00:17:46.990 wrote letters to him. 00:17:46.990 --> 00:17:48.191 I mean, if you imagine 00:17:48.191 --> 00:17:49.271 every woman who goes there, 00:17:49.271 --> 00:17:51.150 for every meeting she has 00:17:51.150 --> 00:17:52.571 with him, making a testimony, 00:17:52.571 --> 00:17:54.371 or he has been doing 00:17:54.371 --> 00:17:56.071 it since, I don’t know 00:17:56.071 --> 00:17:57.870 how many years, yes, 00:17:59.610 --> 00:18:01.070 I can imagine. 00:18:01.070 --> 00:18:03.670 Will Bivoularo be able to protect himself? 00:18:05.540 --> 00:18:06.641 It’t be the only attempt, 00:18:06.641 --> 00:18:08.701 because there is something else, 00:18:08.701 --> 00:18:11.180 a kind of contract. 00:18:11.500 --> 00:18:12.941 Natalie got it at every 00:18:12.941 --> 00:18:14.481 meeting with Bivoularo 00:18:14.481 --> 00:18:15.861 and she should always 00:18:15.861 --> 00:18:17.001 return it signed. 00:18:17.001 --> 00:18:19.321 But at the last visit, 00:18:19.321 --> 00:18:20.560 she forgot it. 00:18:20.560 --> 00:18:21.421 So I practically 00:18:21.421 --> 00:18:22.261 took it with 00:18:22.261 --> 00:18:23.761 me. 00:18:23.780 --> 00:18:24.741 I found it cool, I was a little 00:18:24.741 --> 00:18:25.900 like that then, oh, now I 00:18:25.900 --> 00:18:27.980 have something, I have evidence. 00:18:28.400 --> 00:18:30.021 The document is six pages long, 00:18:30.021 --> 00:18:32.041 black and white, and above it 00:18:32.041 --> 00:18:33.700 is a declaration. 00:18:34.080 --> 00:18:35.281 The text begins with 00:18:35.281 --> 00:18:36.581 the words I, 00:18:36.581 --> 00:18:39.520 the signer, born on, in, declares 00:18:39.560 --> 00:18:41.321 unlimitedly and by own will 00:18:41.321 --> 00:18:42.940 the following. 00:18:42.940 --> 00:18:44.641 So I find it interesting 00:18:44.641 --> 00:18:47.001 what you are trying 00:18:47.001 --> 00:18:48.161 to protect against. 00:18:48.161 --> 00:18:50.000 00:18:50.000 --> 00:18:52.281 You never had alcoholic 00:18:52.281 --> 00:18:54.440 drinks. 00:18:55.280 --> 00:18:57.140 That is bullshit. 00:18:57.140 --> 00:18:58.801 I have never been raped, I 00:18:58.801 --> 00:19:02.201 have never been trafficked, I 00:19:02.201 --> 00:19:05.660 have never been blackmailed, 00:19:05.660 --> 00:19:07.800 threatened, terrorized. 00:19:07.800 --> 00:19:09.881 It’s amazing that it’s 00:19:09.881 --> 00:19:11.081 just here, so it’s over all 00:19:11.081 --> 00:19:12.900 common sense. 00:19:12.900 --> 00:19:14.701 I can’t complain about anything 00:19:14.701 --> 00:19:17.720 that may have traumatized me. 00:19:18.720 --> 00:19:19.841 This letter, which 00:19:19.841 --> 00:19:20.621 probably came up 00:19:20.621 --> 00:19:22.921 after they received 00:19:22.921 --> 00:19:24.440 charges. 00:19:24.580 --> 00:19:24.901 So so. 00:19:24.901 --> 00:19:25.781 And then, of course, they packed 00:19:25.781 --> 00:19:27.061 everything the girl probably 00:19:27.061 --> 00:19:28.740 said then into that note, 00:19:28.740 --> 00:19:29.781 so according to the motto, 00:19:29.781 --> 00:19:31.141 yes, that’s all not 00:19:31.141 --> 00:19:32.640 happening. 00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:34.140 So so. 00:19:34.420 --> 00:19:36.021 All the accusations are not 00:19:36.021 --> 00:19:37.840 with it, right? 00:19:41.940 --> 00:19:44.161 We have shown this statement 00:19:44.161 --> 00:19:45.641 to our lawyer at the Bavarian 00:19:45.641 --> 00:19:47.380 Radio. 00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:49.301 She says that the whole thing would 00:19:49.301 --> 00:19:51.760 not be worth high proof in court. 00:19:51.840 --> 00:19:53.161 Especially if Natalie 00:19:53.161 --> 00:19:54.661 does not confirm her 00:19:54.661 --> 00:19:56.161 information. 00:19:56.220 --> 00:19:58.120 It is not a contract if 00:19:58.120 --> 00:20:00.340 only one party signs it. 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:02.821 But one pressure against 00:20:02.821 --> 00:20:03.841 many women who have 00:20:03.841 --> 00:20:05.181 signed it, with their full 00:20:05.181 --> 00:20:07.780 name, that is the declaration. 00:20:07.780 --> 00:20:10.420 Just like the testimonies. 00:20:10.420 --> 00:20:12.680 Just like the bikini pictures. 00:20:14.660 --> 00:20:15.921 Shortly after her correspondence 00:20:15.921 --> 00:20:18.041 with The Selfsame, Jasper 00:20:18.041 --> 00:20:20.261 receives letters from 00:20:20.261 --> 00:20:22.280 his friends from school. 00:20:22.940 --> 00:20:25.420 Natalie is possessed by demons. 00:20:25.420 --> 00:20:27.420 He should be careful of her. 00:20:30.310 --> 00:20:31.731 This is the moment Natalie 00:20:31.731 --> 00:20:33.890 finally goes out. 00:20:34.390 --> 00:20:37.730 Together with Jasper. Both have themselves. 00:20:37.730 --> 00:20:38.691 Natalie quickly 00:20:38.691 --> 00:20:39.931 returns to her old 00:20:39.931 --> 00:20:40.990 life. 00:20:40.990 --> 00:20:43.570 Her best friend has been waiting 00:20:43.570 --> 00:20:45.230 for her for a long time. 00:20:45.230 --> 00:20:46.591 She always listened, was always 00:20:46.591 --> 00:20:49.150 so totally non-judgmental. 00:20:49.150 --> 00:20:50.331 And when I came out, she was 00:20:50.331 --> 00:20:52.590 like that, hallelujah, I 00:20:52.590 --> 00:20:54.550 was so afraid of you. 00:20:55.510 --> 00:20:56.670 But it did them well because 00:20:56.670 --> 00:20:58.210 it was really like when you 00:20:58.210 --> 00:20:59.711 know that if someone is in 00:20:59.711 --> 00:21:00.751 such a group and starts 00:21:00.751 --> 00:21:04.110 shooting at it, then the person 00:21:04.110 --> 00:21:05.850 stops running away. 00:21:05.850 --> 00:21:07.211 And that’s why, she really 00:21:07.211 --> 00:21:07.791 did well that she was 00:21:07.791 --> 00:21:09.211 always there, always, yes, okay, 00:21:09.211 --> 00:21:10.411 I listen to it. Yes, 00:21:10.411 --> 00:21:13.350 everything is okay. 00:21:13.350 --> 00:21:14.431 Only to keep in 00:21:14.431 --> 00:21:16.770 touch somehow. 00:21:17.310 --> 00:21:18.631 Jasper and Natalie are moving 00:21:18.631 --> 00:21:20.131 to Thailand. 00:21:20.250 --> 00:21:20.631 Natalie 00:21:20.631 --> 00:21:22.770 uses her psychology study. 00:21:22.770 --> 00:21:24.790 She has relationship coaching. 00:21:24.790 --> 00:21:26.290 Jason too. 00:21:26.350 --> 00:21:27.711 The opinions they represent today 00:21:27.711 --> 00:21:29.671 are quite different from those 00:21:29.671 --> 00:21:32.050 of the Atman Yoga movement. 00:21:32.290 --> 00:21:33.531 It is about listening 00:21:33.531 --> 00:21:35.590 to your own body. 00:21:35.590 --> 00:21:37.171 Or seeing jealousy as something 00:21:37.171 --> 00:21:38.371 that is just there and 00:21:38.371 --> 00:21:40.930 cannot be trained away. 00:21:40.930 --> 00:21:43.430 If my body says no, 00:21:43.450 --> 00:21:45.651 that’s not my problem. 00:21:45.651 --> 00:21:46.650 00:21:46.650 --> 00:21:49.411 This is a problem with my 00:21:49.411 --> 00:21:50.850 environment. 00:21:50.850 --> 00:21:51.831 And because the guy 00:21:51.831 --> 00:21:53.331 is not right and because 00:21:53.331 --> 00:21:54.831 I don’t feel safe. 00:21:55.010 --> 00:21:56.451 But that’s not where I 00:21:56.451 --> 00:21:57.151 have to say, boah, 00:21:57.151 --> 00:21:59.850 body, what’s wrong with you? 00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:08.280 Nathalie, read and read, Eva 00:22:08.680 --> 00:22:09.721 They are interviewed 00:22:09.721 --> 00:22:11.481 because they want to warn. 00:22:11.481 --> 00:22:13.201 Because the judiciary 00:22:13.201 --> 00:22:14.800 cannot do anything. 00:22:14.880 --> 00:22:15.941 In the end, they took 00:22:15.941 --> 00:22:18.080 every step voluntarily. 00:22:18.700 --> 00:22:23.020 Then comes the 28. November of 2023. 00:22:32.100 --> 00:22:33.941 Gregorian Bivoularou is arrested 00:22:33.941 --> 00:22:35.620 in France. 00:22:35.620 --> 00:22:37.181 The Paris prosecutor’s office 00:22:37.181 --> 00:22:38.881 is investigating rape, human 00:22:38.881 --> 00:22:39.960 trafficking, abuse 00:22:39.960 --> 00:22:41.061 of trust of protection 00:22:41.061 --> 00:22:43.041 officers and abduction within 00:22:43.041 --> 00:22:44.980 an organized gang. 00:22:45.540 --> 00:22:47.620 Several houses are being searched. 00:22:47.620 --> 00:22:49.981 In Bivoularo, 300,000 euros 00:22:49.981 --> 00:22:51.860 were found in cash. 00:22:52.480 --> 00:22:53.821 In France, the law 00:22:53.821 --> 00:22:56.400 is different than in Germany. 00:22:56.620 --> 00:22:58.041 Spiritual abuse can 00:22:58.041 --> 00:22:59.681 thus be easier to prosecute. 00:22:59.681 --> 00:23:00.720 00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:01.261 There is even 00:23:01.261 --> 00:23:03.061 a sort of sectary paragraph 00:23:03.061 --> 00:23:04.841 and a state committee for the 00:23:04.841 --> 00:23:05.981 supervision and 00:23:05.981 --> 00:23:08.900 of sectarian exchanges. 00:23:09.820 --> 00:23:12.480 When we hear of Bivolarus’ arrest, 00:23:12.480 --> 00:23:13.921 we immediately report to the 00:23:13.921 --> 00:23:14.700 outgoing women 00:23:14.700 --> 00:23:16.600 we are in contact with. 00:23:16.800 --> 00:23:18.860 They send us language messages. 00:23:19.900 --> 00:23:21.181 I hope that now with the statements 00:23:21.181 --> 00:23:23.380 in the background that 00:23:23.380 --> 00:23:28.201 this is enough, he somehow... 00:23:28.201 --> 00:23:30.760 First, to hold it for a lot longer. 00:23:31.320 --> 00:23:32.501 Whether there is really 00:23:32.501 --> 00:23:34.900 enough evidence for a conviction, 00:23:34.900 --> 00:23:37.561 we don’t know now in March 00:23:37.561 --> 00:23:38.661 2024, when we produce 00:23:38.661 --> 00:23:40.240 this podcast. 00:23:40.280 --> 00:23:42.520 Until then, the presumption of innocence is valid. 00:23:42.520 --> 00:23:44.260 The best part would be if 00:23:44.260 --> 00:23:45.121 all the other schools 00:23:45.121 --> 00:23:46.781 could also go to 00:23:46.781 --> 00:23:48.281 book. 00:23:49.620 --> 00:23:51.440 It leaves no clue what now, 00:23:51.440 --> 00:23:52.441 so to speak, breaks this 00:23:52.441 --> 00:23:53.921 shit down in such a really 00:23:53.921 --> 00:23:55.101 cool epic 00:23:55.101 --> 00:23:57.060 domino effect. 00:23:59.610 --> 00:24:01.370 Read Natalie and Eva, 00:24:01.370 --> 00:24:02.711 they all follow our 00:24:02.711 --> 00:24:03.551 reporting on the 00:24:03.551 --> 00:24:05.510 bivular arrest. 00:24:05.510 --> 00:24:06.871 You read that the German Academy 00:24:06.871 --> 00:24:08.931 of Traditional Yoga writes about 00:24:08.931 --> 00:24:10.091 the allegations against 00:24:10.091 --> 00:24:11.810 Bivoularo? 00:24:21.050 --> 00:24:22.731 You are not aware of such 00:24:22.731 --> 00:24:24.130 witnesses that have 00:24:24.130 --> 00:24:26.290 a connection to data. 00:24:26.470 --> 00:24:28.690 And there are no cases of brainwashing, 00:24:28.690 --> 00:24:31.210 manipulation and power abuse. 00:24:31.850 --> 00:24:34.730 Read and Eve make these words angry. 00:24:35.330 --> 00:24:37.031 Natalie is not surprised. 00:24:37.031 --> 00:24:38.731 So you have it now or even 00:24:38.731 --> 00:24:39.731 the German school stop right 00:24:39.731 --> 00:24:40.971 now says yes we have nothing 00:24:40.971 --> 00:24:41.431 to do with it, 00:24:41.431 --> 00:24:43.131 we manipulate no 00:24:43.131 --> 00:24:45.471 one and brainwashing 00:24:45.471 --> 00:24:47.210 is not and so on. 00:24:47.210 --> 00:24:47.691 I can see it 00:24:47.691 --> 00:24:48.651 somewhere because the thing 00:24:48.651 --> 00:24:50.211 is the people who write 00:24:50.211 --> 00:24:53.570 this are manipulated. 00:24:53.570 --> 00:24:55.131 This is not brainwashing, 00:24:55.131 --> 00:24:55.890 of course. 00:24:55.890 --> 00:24:57.390 So they do not see it. 00:24:57.470 --> 00:24:59.130 When I was inside, 00:24:59.130 --> 00:25:00.630 I didn’t see it either. 00:25:01.470 --> 00:25:02.871 Natalie also thinks of the 00:25:02.871 --> 00:25:04.411 many women that police have 00:25:04.411 --> 00:25:05.931 found in their raids in 00:25:05.931 --> 00:25:08.430 the shabby apartments. 00:25:09.190 --> 00:25:10.211 In the media, yes, they 00:25:10.211 --> 00:25:11.230 were released. 00:25:11.230 --> 00:25:12.331 But the thing is, 00:25:12.331 --> 00:25:14.190 the girls who were 00:25:14.990 --> 00:25:16.091 there will not see 00:25:16.091 --> 00:25:17.690 it mostly. 00:25:17.830 --> 00:25:19.770 He is being pursued by the police. 00:25:19.770 --> 00:25:22.391 That was part of the 00:25:22.391 --> 00:25:23.231 story that they always 00:25:23.231 --> 00:25:24.270 told us. 00:25:24.270 --> 00:25:25.131 So I don’t think that 00:25:25.131 --> 00:25:26.470 is somehow so now. 00:25:26.470 --> 00:25:27.970 So, according to the motto, 00:25:28.290 --> 00:25:29.131 okay, now I was released here 00:25:29.131 --> 00:25:31.010 and now the subject of school is over. 00:25:35.750 --> 00:25:37.911 Natalie still knows the school’ 00:25:37.911 --> 00:25:40.630 s mind world incredibly well. 00:25:40.630 --> 00:25:42.191 This is where Misa, the 00:25:42.191 --> 00:25:43.771 Romanian yoga school, 00:25:43.771 --> 00:25:46.430 is in place. by 12. 00:25:46.430 --> 00:25:47.851 In December, exactly 00:25:47.851 --> 00:25:49.930 two weeks after Bivolarus’ 00:25:49.930 --> 00:25:51.571 arrest, in a press release 00:25:51.571 --> 00:25:52.511 titled accusations 00:25:52.511 --> 00:25:54.511 overcame the 00:25:54.511 --> 00:25:55.870 media. 00:25:55.870 --> 00:25:57.850 Where are the victims? 00:25:58.470 --> 00:25:59.970 Misa writes 00:26:05.470 --> 00:26:07.730 as a victim of a rape. 00:26:08.810 --> 00:26:10.051 We talked about this 00:26:10.051 --> 00:26:12.310 with Misa spokeswoman Cosmina 00:26:12.310 --> 00:26:14.150 Oprah. 00:26:14.310 --> 00:26:15.951 She tells us that she spoke 00:26:15.951 --> 00:26:18.130 with some Romanian women who were 00:26:18.130 --> 00:26:19.511 found by the police during 00:26:19.511 --> 00:26:20.591 the raids in 00:26:20.591 --> 00:26:22.091 the houses. 00:26:25.330 --> 00:26:26.891 Some of these women, the press 00:26:26.891 --> 00:26:28.590 spokeswoman tells us, 00:26:28.590 --> 00:26:30.631 were traumatized, yes, but 00:26:30.631 --> 00:26:31.370 because of 00:26:31.370 --> 00:26:32.811 the way the French police 00:26:32.811 --> 00:26:34.370 treated them. 00:26:45.050 --> 00:26:47.471 The police acted extremely 00:26:47.471 --> 00:26:49.250 aggressively. 00:26:49.270 --> 00:26:50.071 It is the spiritual 00:26:50.071 --> 00:26:51.831 communities that are the focus 00:26:51.831 --> 00:26:53.490 of state persecution, 00:26:53.490 --> 00:26:54.610 she tells us. 00:26:54.610 --> 00:26:56.830 She is 100% sure that 00:26:56.830 --> 00:26:59.230 Bivoularo is innocent. 00:27:14.750 --> 00:27:17.311 If it was so bad, why have 00:27:17.311 --> 00:27:18.911 thousands of people been 00:27:18.911 --> 00:27:21.030 left in school for years? 00:27:21.570 --> 00:27:23.091 We want to know from Cosmina 00:27:23.091 --> 00:27:24.791 Oprah whether the houses 00:27:24.791 --> 00:27:26.051 where the women stayed in 00:27:26.051 --> 00:27:29.210 Paris are mixed-house houses. 00:27:29.210 --> 00:27:30.590 No, she says. 00:27:30.590 --> 00:27:31.951 She suspects that the houses 00:27:31.951 --> 00:27:34.111 belong to private people, the 00:27:34.111 --> 00:27:35.151 yogis provided to take 00:27:35.151 --> 00:27:37.091 there some sort of spiritual 00:27:37.091 --> 00:27:38.750 break. 00:27:56.230 --> 00:27:58.850 Speaking of spiritual development. 00:27:59.190 --> 00:28:00.171 We want to know 00:28:00.171 --> 00:28:01.650 what is happening 00:28:01.650 --> 00:28:03.291 at Bivolaru in 00:28:03.291 --> 00:28:04.950 Paris. 00:28:05.150 --> 00:28:07.291 We talked to some 00:28:07.291 --> 00:28:08.730 yoga students. 00:28:08.730 --> 00:28:10.071 They told us that they were 00:28:10.071 --> 00:28:14.091 going into a kind of initiation 00:28:14.091 --> 00:28:15.671 with Gagauian Bivoularo, which 00:28:15.671 --> 00:28:18.390 was Tantric. 00:28:18.950 --> 00:28:20.350 I have read it. 00:28:20.350 --> 00:28:21.971 I read this 00:28:21.971 --> 00:28:22.650 in the news. 00:28:22.650 --> 00:28:24.170 Okay, if you said you should 00:28:24.170 --> 00:28:25.870 explain what it was, then you should 00:28:25.870 --> 00:28:27.490 be able to check it out. 00:28:27.490 --> 00:28:28.451 That is the only thing I 00:28:28.451 --> 00:28:29.910 can say. 00:28:29.910 --> 00:28:31.051 So you say it exists 00:28:31.051 --> 00:28:33.490 or not? No, no is no. 00:28:33.670 --> 00:28:35.170 I do not know. 00:28:42.230 --> 00:28:44.871 According to Misa, women 00:28:44.871 --> 00:28:46.550 should bring evidence. 00:28:46.770 --> 00:28:47.951 It is hard to give up 00:28:47.951 --> 00:28:49.650 your phone first. 00:28:50.410 --> 00:28:52.590 As Christiane added, some of 00:28:52.590 --> 00:28:53.951 the women would have called 00:28:53.951 --> 00:28:55.351 what happened to Bivoularo 00:28:55.351 --> 00:28:56.771 abuse in retrospect, as 00:28:56.771 --> 00:28:58.311 the press spokeswoman 00:28:58.311 --> 00:28:59.351 answers. 00:28:59.351 --> 00:29:02.110 What do they mean it was abuse? 00:29:02.490 --> 00:29:03.770 They said they did something, they 00:29:03.770 --> 00:29:05.091 were forced to do it, they 00:29:05.091 --> 00:29:06.071 were not forced to do it, they 00:29:06.071 --> 00:29:07.470 changed their minds. 00:29:07.470 --> 00:29:09.430 What do you mean by abuse? 00:29:09.430 --> 00:29:10.671 You say you were forced 00:29:10.671 --> 00:29:12.110 to do something? 00:29:12.110 --> 00:29:13.890 Would you have changed your mind? 00:29:13.890 --> 00:29:15.791 The fact that people, you 00:29:15.791 --> 00:29:18.591 know, realize after some years 00:29:18.591 --> 00:29:20.210 that they were abused, 00:29:20.210 --> 00:29:21.710 traumatized, whatever. 00:29:21.830 --> 00:29:24.131 And only after someone else 00:29:24.131 --> 00:29:26.191 is telling them like an expert. 00:29:26.191 --> 00:29:27.711 These things are really 00:29:27.711 --> 00:29:30.630 strange and not very familiar. 00:29:30.910 --> 00:29:32.111 And in many, many times, 00:29:32.111 --> 00:29:34.630 they are read wrong. 00:30:02.070 --> 00:30:04.571 We want to know if she knows 00:30:04.571 --> 00:30:06.270 of any yoga student who has 00:30:06.270 --> 00:30:08.011 made love with Bivularo, 00:30:08.011 --> 00:30:09.770 at an initiation. 00:30:12.050 --> 00:30:13.431 We want to know if you 00:30:13.431 --> 00:30:15.131 know that women were brought 00:30:15.131 --> 00:30:16.731 to Paris from Romania, with 00:30:16.731 --> 00:30:18.491 fishermen’s hats and sunglasses, 00:30:18.491 --> 00:30:20.770 by poor people. 00:30:49.810 --> 00:30:52.911 The official position of the Mieser – 00:30:52.911 --> 00:30:54.431 we are not aware that something 00:30:54.431 --> 00:30:56.210 like this is happening in Romania. 00:30:56.210 --> 00:30:58.011 She doesn’t pretend to know everything 00:30:58.011 --> 00:31:00.190 that’s happening in the world. 00:31:06.450 --> 00:31:07.971 After Bivolarus’ arrest, 00:31:07.971 --> 00:31:09.311 we publish an article 00:31:09.311 --> 00:31:12.190 on BR24 and write about this 00:31:12.190 --> 00:31:14.650 podcast being in work here. 00:31:14.870 --> 00:31:16.430 Anyone who has any clues for 00:31:16.430 --> 00:31:18.690 us may be happy to contact us. 00:31:19.290 --> 00:31:20.790 And actually. 00:31:21.610 --> 00:31:22.950 People are reporting. 00:31:22.950 --> 00:31:24.791 They write that they also have 00:31:24.791 --> 00:31:26.011 experience with the yoga 00:31:26.011 --> 00:31:28.510 movement and with Bivolaru. 00:31:28.550 --> 00:31:30.211 Almost all of them were with 00:31:30.211 --> 00:31:30.750 the Germans 00:31:30.750 --> 00:31:33.110 for traditional yoga. 00:31:33.190 --> 00:31:34.731 In Munich, in Freiburg, in 00:31:34.731 --> 00:31:36.911 Dresden, in Berlin. Their 00:31:36.911 --> 00:31:38.491 experiences vary in length, but 00:31:38.491 --> 00:31:39.851 their memories are 00:31:39.851 --> 00:31:41.211 strongly intertwined, 00:31:41.211 --> 00:31:43.170 even in details. 00:31:44.720 --> 00:31:46.401 They tell us about cleaning 00:31:46.401 --> 00:31:48.001 as karma yoga, bikini 00:31:48.001 --> 00:31:49.281 photos, shakti 00:31:49.281 --> 00:31:51.321 groups, women with shaved 00:31:51.321 --> 00:31:54.360 heads, medicinal herbs. 00:31:54.360 --> 00:31:55.201 One had a cancer- 00:31:55.201 --> 00:31:56.821 affected girlfriend who did not get 00:31:56.821 --> 00:31:58.880 treatment and died. 00:31:58.880 --> 00:32:01.340 They tell us about brainwashing, 00:32:01.340 --> 00:32:02.840 some 00:32:03.440 --> 00:32:05.241 of them have received an 00:32:05.241 --> 00:32:07.181 invitation from Bivolaru – 00:32:07.181 --> 00:32:09.181 passed by a yoga teacher 00:32:09.181 --> 00:32:10.800 or a yoga teacher. 00:32:11.420 --> 00:32:12.361 One describes a conspiracy 00:32:12.361 --> 00:32:14.061 meeting in the park – super 00:32:14.061 --> 00:32:15.561 secret. 00:32:15.800 --> 00:32:17.561 The trip to Bivolaru 00:32:17.561 --> 00:32:18.701 itself did not do some 00:32:18.701 --> 00:32:21.180 of them, others did. 00:32:21.620 --> 00:32:23.501 More than 20 outbound 00:32:23.501 --> 00:32:25.001 women, with whom we 00:32:25.001 --> 00:32:26.860 alone had contact. 00:32:29.300 --> 00:32:30.901 What does the German Academy of Traditional 00:32:30.901 --> 00:32:33.140 Yoga say about this? 00:32:33.220 --> 00:32:34.781 We have been waiting for a long 00:32:34.781 --> 00:32:36.260 time for a response. 00:32:36.260 --> 00:32:39.420 It is here in early March 2024. 00:32:39.660 --> 00:32:40.641 The Chairman of 00:32:40.641 --> 00:32:42.141 DATI wrote to Christiane 00:32:42.141 --> 00:32:43.841 and she called me, of 00:32:43.841 --> 00:32:45.320 course, immediately. 00:32:45.320 --> 00:32:47.400 The mail is here. 00:32:47.420 --> 00:32:48.820 I will put it up now. 00:32:48.820 --> 00:32:51.241 He has one, so exactly, 00:32:51.241 --> 00:32:51.701 he apologizes 00:32:51.701 --> 00:32:53.001 again for taking it 00:32:53.001 --> 00:32:54.181 so long now and here 00:32:54.181 --> 00:32:56.220 are the answers. 00:32:56.940 --> 00:32:58.581 For almost three months, there was 00:32:58.581 --> 00:32:59.941 a relationship between us and 00:32:59.941 --> 00:33:01.540 the Chairman of the DATI. 00:33:01.540 --> 00:33:03.961 He is currently in Munich and here 00:33:03.961 --> 00:33:06.400 is the headquarters of the association. 00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:07.461 We would like to go through 00:33:07.461 --> 00:33:09.260 him for an interview, but he 00:33:09.260 --> 00:33:10.221 only wants to answer 00:33:10.221 --> 00:33:11.721 us in writing. 00:33:11.880 --> 00:33:15.521 It is six pages long, yes. 00:33:15.521 --> 00:33:17.441 Christiane is looking for 00:33:17.441 --> 00:33:18.461 the point that interests 00:33:18.461 --> 00:33:19.820 us most. 00:33:19.820 --> 00:33:21.841 Whether the data knows that 00:33:21.841 --> 00:33:23.741 also the female students of them 00:33:23.741 --> 00:33:25.201 went to Gregoriam Bivoularo 00:33:25.201 --> 00:33:26.841 to Paris, for the so- 00:33:26.841 --> 00:33:28.361 called initiation. 00:33:28.361 --> 00:33:30.700 He writes very lapidary. 00:33:30.840 --> 00:33:33.000 No, we are not aware of that. 00:33:33.740 --> 00:33:35.240 There are some, say, 00:33:35.240 --> 00:33:36.541 who call this backward 00:33:36.541 --> 00:33:37.320 as abuse. 00:33:37.320 --> 00:33:39.100 How do you evaluate it? 00:33:39.400 --> 00:33:41.980 And then he simply says quite flat, 00:33:41.980 --> 00:33:43.641 the Dati condemns abuse of protection 00:33:43.641 --> 00:33:45.141 orders, rape, human 00:33:45.200 --> 00:33:46.641 trafficking or deprivation 00:33:46.641 --> 00:33:48.500 of liberty. 00:33:48.500 --> 00:33:50.421 Like any other criminal 00:33:50.421 --> 00:33:52.320 offence. 00:33:53.000 --> 00:33:54.681 We feel that where it becomes 00:33:54.681 --> 00:33:55.701 critical, the data 00:33:55.701 --> 00:33:58.820 chairman is going to turn us out. 00:33:58.820 --> 00:34:00.661 The Dati refers to being an 00:34:00.661 --> 00:34:02.081 independent association and 00:34:02.081 --> 00:34:04.241 not having any touch points too 00:34:04.241 --> 00:34:05.681 poor except for some empty 00:34:05.681 --> 00:34:07.120 content. 00:34:07.120 --> 00:34:08.201 They are in the same 00:34:08.201 --> 00:34:10.380 area, at the Atman. 00:34:10.920 --> 00:34:12.681 He also said that every 00:34:12.681 --> 00:34:14.880 offer is voluntary. 00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:17.320 To clean the body. 00:34:17.520 --> 00:34:18.741 Liz told us on the red ceiling 00:34:18.741 --> 00:34:20.000 in the park that she 00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:21.121 had become very thin in 00:34:21.121 --> 00:34:22.940 the yoga experience. 00:34:22.940 --> 00:34:24.161 The fast was extreme. 00:34:24.161 --> 00:34:26.601 The data writes that we generally 00:34:26.601 --> 00:34:29.740 discourage extreme cures. 00:34:29.820 --> 00:34:31.780 Now, be careful, it is coming. 00:34:32.080 --> 00:34:33.401 Our question is, according to our research, 00:34:33.401 --> 00:34:34.881 there is a kind of ritual in 00:34:34.881 --> 00:34:37.600 the Shakti groups or in the other. 00:34:37.600 --> 00:34:39.740 for admission to an ashram. 00:34:39.840 --> 00:34:42.100 The presentation of a bikini photo. 00:34:42.100 --> 00:34:43.500 Is this correct? 00:34:43.500 --> 00:34:45.721 There are no recording rituals 00:34:45.721 --> 00:34:48.581 for any of the Dati events 00:34:48.581 --> 00:34:50.121 and no photos are 00:34:50.121 --> 00:34:52.920 required in any form. 00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:54.801 Of course, ex-members explain 00:34:54.801 --> 00:34:56.101 to us, it is not required, 00:34:56.101 --> 00:34:57.441 but it is all voluntary. 00:34:57.441 --> 00:34:59.180 00:34:59.280 --> 00:35:00.601 Also with the allegedly 00:35:00.601 --> 00:35:02.420 demonic series and films 00:35:02.420 --> 00:35:04.560 that Liz has told us. 00:35:04.620 --> 00:35:06.021 Each participant should decide 00:35:06.021 --> 00:35:07.741 for himself, based on the principles 00:35:07.741 --> 00:35:09.760 of the courses. 00:35:09.840 --> 00:35:11.561 And the students should actually 00:35:11.561 --> 00:35:12.681 keep certain course 00:35:12.681 --> 00:35:14.480 content secret. 00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:16.581 Not everyone is adequately 00:35:16.581 --> 00:35:18.280 informed in the methods, 00:35:18.280 --> 00:35:19.520 writes the data chairman. 00:35:19.520 --> 00:35:22.100 The next sentence that comes, 00:35:22.100 --> 00:35:23.720 I find it really rough, 00:35:23.720 --> 00:35:25.281 because I have just recently 00:35:25.281 --> 00:35:26.361 talked again with 00:35:26.361 --> 00:35:28.001 several who have told me 00:35:28.001 --> 00:35:30.280 the exact opposite. 00:35:30.600 --> 00:35:32.900 And it was very credible. 00:35:34.240 --> 00:35:36.141 The Chairman writes that there 00:35:36.141 --> 00:35:38.861 are no meditations in our 00:35:38.861 --> 00:35:40.100 events where participants 00:35:40.100 --> 00:35:41.721 are to practice with pictures 00:35:41.721 --> 00:35:43.341 of Grigorian 00:35:43.341 --> 00:35:45.220 Bivoularo. 00:35:46.040 --> 00:35:47.540 To practice? 00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:49.961 So now, does it mean no one tells 00:35:49.961 --> 00:35:52.040 you that you have to do that, but some 00:35:52.040 --> 00:35:53.361 are volunteering to 00:35:53.361 --> 00:35:55.800 meditate on Bivoularo photos? 00:35:56.340 --> 00:35:57.521 We will send you an email 00:35:57.521 --> 00:35:59.480 with requests, but 00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:01.080 nothing comes back. 00:36:01.560 --> 00:36:02.821 We would also like to talk 00:36:02.821 --> 00:36:04.341 to the data chairman personally 00:36:04.341 --> 00:36:06.740 on another topic, because there 00:36:06.740 --> 00:36:07.441 is also room 00:36:07.441 --> 00:36:09.820 for interpretation. 00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:11.901 After our research, Dati 00:36:11.901 --> 00:36:13.760 had the opportunity to 00:36:13.760 --> 00:36:14.861 write messages to Gregorian 00:36:14.861 --> 00:36:16.101 Bivoularo to get 00:36:16.101 --> 00:36:18.760 advice from him. 00:36:18.900 --> 00:36:20.461 The communication wasly 00:36:20.461 --> 00:36:22.301 through yoga teachers 00:36:22.301 --> 00:36:23.560 of the Dati. 00:36:23.560 --> 00:36:25.200 Are you familiar with it? 00:36:25.220 --> 00:36:28.560 The data does not offer such a thing. 00:36:29.180 --> 00:36:31.121 Are the data yoga teachers not 00:36:31.121 --> 00:36:32.960 part of the data? 00:36:33.340 --> 00:36:34.241 Or is it a private 00:36:34.241 --> 00:36:36.460 matter for the teachers? 00:36:36.480 --> 00:36:38.420 Or no offer? 00:36:38.540 --> 00:36:40.340 We are confused. 00:36:40.500 --> 00:36:41.881 We hope to get a clear 00:36:41.881 --> 00:36:43.361 and unambiguous 00:36:43.361 --> 00:36:44.701 answer to 00:36:44.701 --> 00:36:47.280 the last question. 00:36:47.800 --> 00:36:49.721 Whether the data is known that their 00:36:49.721 --> 00:36:51.601 participants sought advice from Bivoularo 00:36:51.601 --> 00:36:53.401 in case of health problems 00:36:53.401 --> 00:36:56.220 rather than going to the doctor. 00:36:56.380 --> 00:36:57.681 The Dati stands for 00:36:57.681 --> 00:36:59.201 the position that any 00:36:59.201 --> 00:37:00.741 health problem should 00:37:00.741 --> 00:37:03.461 be examined by a 00:37:03.461 --> 00:37:06.960 doctor or health practitioner. 00:37:07.060 --> 00:37:08.561 This is also stated in the 00:37:08.561 --> 00:37:10.960 conditions of the association. 00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:12.700 I find it extremely exciting 00:37:12.700 --> 00:37:14.561 that the doctor and the therapist 00:37:14.561 --> 00:37:18.460 are on an equal footing. 00:37:19.700 --> 00:37:21.880 It fits well into the picture, 00:37:21.880 --> 00:37:23.380 in any case. 00:37:23.600 --> 00:37:25.201 All these questions and 00:37:25.201 --> 00:37:26.581 more, of course, we also 00:37:26.581 --> 00:37:28.740 asked Gregoriam Bivoularo. 00:37:29.040 --> 00:37:29.881 We did not receive 00:37:29.881 --> 00:37:31.181 any answers until the end 00:37:31.181 --> 00:37:32.500 of the edition. 00:37:32.500 --> 00:37:35.020 Neither by him nor by his lawyer. 00:37:35.320 --> 00:37:36.781 The only thing we can 00:37:36.781 --> 00:37:38.301 find about his position 00:37:38.301 --> 00:37:40.320 is a French article. 00:37:40.580 --> 00:37:42.301 In it we read that Bivoularo 00:37:42.301 --> 00:37:43.960 said at the time of his arrest that 00:37:43.960 --> 00:37:45.981 he was going to be a political 00:37:45.981 --> 00:37:47.481 conspiracy. 00:37:47.600 --> 00:37:48.661 He was a spiritual 00:37:48.661 --> 00:37:50.381 master and the women loved 00:37:50.381 --> 00:37:52.061 him in his home after 00:37:52.061 --> 00:37:53.621 a step called initiation. 00:37:53.621 --> 00:37:55.120 00:37:55.120 --> 00:37:57.100 His lawyer is also quoted. 00:37:57.100 --> 00:37:58.161 Bivolarus’ innocence 00:37:58.161 --> 00:37:59.661 will be proved. 00:38:06.780 --> 00:38:08.880 Liz has now done the first 00:38:09.060 --> 00:38:09.881 preventive examinations. 00:38:09.881 --> 00:38:11.100 00:38:11.100 --> 00:38:12.561 Her chronic illness makes her 00:38:12.561 --> 00:38:13.281 constantly worried 00:38:13.281 --> 00:38:14.641 and she is worried that 00:38:14.641 --> 00:38:16.181 she is now having consequences, 00:38:16.181 --> 00:38:18.361 because at the time at yoga school 00:38:18.361 --> 00:38:20.161 she was not at the regular 00:38:20.161 --> 00:38:22.460 check-ups with the doctor. 00:38:23.960 --> 00:38:26.441 Now I have chilled my 00:38:26.441 --> 00:38:29.581 mind so much that I see 00:38:29.581 --> 00:38:30.901 that these are all normal 00:38:30.901 --> 00:38:32.061 people who just 00:38:32.061 --> 00:38:33.580 do their job. 00:38:33.580 --> 00:38:35.120 I finally managed to 00:38:35.120 --> 00:38:36.360 make a date. 00:38:36.360 --> 00:38:37.081 I have not been there 00:38:37.081 --> 00:38:38.261 for two or four 00:38:38.261 --> 00:38:39.680 years now. 00:38:39.680 --> 00:38:41.221 She still lives with very little 00:38:41.221 --> 00:38:42.861 money, gets food at the 00:38:42.861 --> 00:38:46.160 table, makes it hard for groups. 00:38:46.160 --> 00:38:47.281 Finding a fixed job 00:38:47.281 --> 00:38:48.821 and getting along with your 00:38:48.821 --> 00:38:50.841 colleagues is not easy 00:38:50.841 --> 00:38:52.341 for them. 00:38:52.680 --> 00:38:54.141 I was just really sharply 00:38:54.141 --> 00:38:56.001 extremist and radical and on 00:38:56.001 --> 00:38:58.440 the smallest things that were somehow 00:38:58.840 --> 00:38:59.761 against my attitude, I 00:38:59.761 --> 00:39:01.301 immediately started the 00:39:01.301 --> 00:39:02.761 declarations of war and 00:39:02.761 --> 00:39:03.961 immediately 00:39:03.961 --> 00:39:04.981 somehow blown them everything 00:39:04.981 --> 00:39:07.160 in the face. 00:39:11.770 --> 00:39:13.871 At a consultancy, Liz learns that this 00:39:13.871 --> 00:39:15.471 anger has many outgoers 00:39:15.471 --> 00:39:17.051 from destructive groups 00:39:17.051 --> 00:39:19.390 and she also learns that this 00:39:19.390 --> 00:39:21.090 anger may be. 00:39:21.110 --> 00:39:22.610 It is even important. 00:39:23.150 --> 00:39:24.711 In her time at Dati, 00:39:24.711 --> 00:39:26.370 Liz has always tried 00:39:26.370 --> 00:39:28.490 to adapt to her group. 00:39:28.930 --> 00:39:30.331 All the feelings that didn’ 00:39:30.331 --> 00:39:32.011 t fit in some way, she 00:39:32.011 --> 00:39:33.850 meditated away. 00:39:34.390 --> 00:39:35.431 The anger she feels 00:39:35.431 --> 00:39:38.390 now comes from deep inside. 00:39:38.510 --> 00:39:43.351 Your inner self, which 00:39:43.351 --> 00:39:45.271 does not show my limits. If 00:39:45.271 --> 00:39:46.591 I notice something is so 00:39:46.591 --> 00:39:48.310 bad for me, it’s not okay 00:39:48.310 --> 00:39:48.771 that I dare 00:39:48.771 --> 00:39:50.490 to say that. 00:39:50.770 --> 00:39:53.310 This is super important to me. 00:39:53.970 --> 00:39:55.931 It is also important, in the consultancy, 00:39:55.931 --> 00:39:57.811 to tell her that reading 00:39:57.811 --> 00:39:59.030 is time. 00:39:59.030 --> 00:40:01.310 But that is what makes her create. 00:40:02.070 --> 00:40:02.551 Time is like 00:40:02.551 --> 00:40:04.591 a race with time because 00:40:04.591 --> 00:40:07.410 I am getting older. 00:40:07.410 --> 00:40:09.561 People who are now in my 00:40:09.561 --> 00:40:11.321 age, who have already 00:40:11.321 --> 00:40:12.661 founded a house or family 00:40:12.661 --> 00:40:13.640 somewhere. 00:40:13.640 --> 00:40:13.901 So they 00:40:13.901 --> 00:40:16.580 are really elsewhere. 00:40:16.580 --> 00:40:17.081 But I am 00:40:17.081 --> 00:40:20.361 still far away, so I am 00:40:20.361 --> 00:40:21.820 not where others are. 00:40:21.820 --> 00:40:22.601 And I have 00:40:22.601 --> 00:40:24.021 had a lot of difficulty 00:40:24.021 --> 00:40:26.141 getting more and more awareness 00:40:26.141 --> 00:40:27.121 of this in the last 00:40:27.121 --> 00:40:28.621 few months. And even 00:40:28.621 --> 00:40:29.821 this huge pain, I can’ 00:40:29.821 --> 00:40:31.201 t change it anymore. 00:40:31.201 --> 00:40:33.061 So it is now so. 00:40:33.061 --> 00:40:34.041 And I have to do the 00:40:34.041 --> 00:40:35.480 best of what remains 00:40:35.480 --> 00:40:37.560 to me. 00:40:38.100 --> 00:40:40.220 That is brutal. 00:40:41.180 --> 00:40:41.921 So that’s something that 00:40:41.921 --> 00:40:43.001 has been stolen from 00:40:43.001 --> 00:40:44.920 one’s experience 00:40:45.300 --> 00:40:47.300 as life. 00:40:52.920 --> 00:40:56.260 18 is December of 2023. 00:40:57.850 --> 00:40:59.251 Liz stands in front of the State 00:40:59.251 --> 00:41:01.410 Criminal Office building. 00:41:01.410 --> 00:41:01.631 She 00:41:01.631 --> 00:41:03.230 breathes deep. 00:41:03.410 --> 00:41:04.731 I really trembled without end, 00:41:04.731 --> 00:41:07.010 I had trembling legs. 00:41:07.130 --> 00:41:08.111 I could even I 00:41:08.111 --> 00:41:09.191 actually wanted to prepare 00:41:09.191 --> 00:41:10.691 super sharply and write texts 00:41:10.691 --> 00:41:12.251 and so everything went 00:41:12.251 --> 00:41:13.430 nothing. 00:41:13.430 --> 00:41:14.770 I just had to go as 00:41:14.770 --> 00:41:16.270 I am. 00:41:16.470 --> 00:41:18.670 Your therapist is also present. 00:41:19.450 --> 00:41:22.441 The two enter and meet a 00:41:22.441 --> 00:41:24.021 official from the human trafficking 00:41:24.021 --> 00:41:25.520 department. 00:41:25.520 --> 00:41:26.481 I saw her and immediately 00:41:26.481 --> 00:41:27.521 felt I could trust 00:41:27.521 --> 00:41:28.540 her. 00:41:28.540 --> 00:41:30.541 She is nice, she is 00:41:30.541 --> 00:41:32.440 empathic, here I am sure. 00:41:32.440 --> 00:41:33.161 That was such 00:41:33.161 --> 00:41:35.241 a huge relief. 00:41:35.241 --> 00:41:37.541 And then we really were 00:41:37.541 --> 00:41:39.101 only three, so only women, 00:41:39.101 --> 00:41:41.040 which also did well. 00:41:41.040 --> 00:41:42.281 She gave me a lot of time 00:41:42.281 --> 00:41:43.841 and space and I could tell 00:41:43.841 --> 00:41:44.920 her everything. 00:41:44.920 --> 00:41:46.141 I could finally tell 00:41:46.141 --> 00:41:47.721 everything and I felt 00:41:47.721 --> 00:41:49.461 like that, that’s why 00:41:49.461 --> 00:41:50.980 I did it all now. 00:41:53.270 --> 00:41:54.571 Liz tells about her 00:41:54.571 --> 00:41:55.851 experiences at the German 00:41:55.851 --> 00:41:58.430 Academy for Traditional Yoga. 00:41:58.910 --> 00:42:00.451 About how she felt 00:42:00.451 --> 00:42:01.931 pushed to take bikini 00:42:01.931 --> 00:42:03.711 photos to join 00:42:03.711 --> 00:42:04.971 certain groups. 00:42:04.971 --> 00:42:07.550 The fasting challenges. 00:42:08.590 --> 00:42:09.671 When I sat there, in that 00:42:09.671 --> 00:42:11.610 chair, in front of that woman, 00:42:11.610 --> 00:42:12.591 where I then told all 00:42:12.591 --> 00:42:14.770 the details of what I experienced 00:42:14.770 --> 00:42:15.711 there, and I started listening 00:42:15.711 --> 00:42:16.610 to myself, and 00:42:16.610 --> 00:42:18.690 so I realized, oh shit, that is 00:42:18.690 --> 00:42:20.310 now somehow really true, so 00:42:20.310 --> 00:42:21.670 that’s all really happened. 00:42:21.670 --> 00:42:23.030 I was really sitting, and 00:42:23.030 --> 00:42:24.530 that was real, so 00:42:24.530 --> 00:42:26.590 I had hardly any strength. 00:42:27.350 --> 00:42:28.371 I somehow with all my 00:42:28.371 --> 00:42:29.011 strength somehow 00:42:29.011 --> 00:42:30.650 squeezed out everything I remembered, 00:42:30.650 --> 00:42:33.331 and it was that it really 00:42:33.331 --> 00:42:34.930 isn’t easy. 00:42:36.320 --> 00:42:38.000 Read continues to tell. 00:42:38.300 --> 00:42:40.161 As they say, her therapist 00:42:40.161 --> 00:42:42.960 was possessed by Satan. 00:42:43.140 --> 00:42:44.440 That she was in mind, doctors 00:42:44.440 --> 00:42:46.520 are demonic. 00:42:46.600 --> 00:42:48.061 She wanted to put all 00:42:48.061 --> 00:42:49.960 her money in herbs. 00:42:50.920 --> 00:42:53.741 And then, after 2 hours, it 00:42:53.741 --> 00:42:55.241 is ready. 00:42:55.300 --> 00:42:56.561 It was like a feeling 00:42:56.561 --> 00:42:58.940 of having run for a long time 00:42:59.040 --> 00:42:59.921 and then finally managed 00:42:59.921 --> 00:43:01.740 to get to the goal. 00:43:01.760 --> 00:43:03.061 So, and then I have 00:43:03.061 --> 00:43:04.360 somehow that whole package 00:43:04.360 --> 00:43:05.960 that I always carried with me, 00:43:05.960 --> 00:43:09.941 like such a huge mountain 00:43:09.941 --> 00:43:11.301 that I always carried 00:43:11.301 --> 00:43:13.161 alone, I could finally just take 00:43:13.161 --> 00:43:14.581 where and say, okay, you 00:43:14.581 --> 00:43:15.901 are the experts, I now 00:43:15.901 --> 00:43:17.101 give you this mountain 00:43:17.101 --> 00:43:18.401 of experiences that 00:43:18.401 --> 00:43:19.541 I have in your hands 00:43:19.541 --> 00:43:21.661 and then you can do 00:43:21.661 --> 00:43:23.220 what you want. 00:43:23.220 --> 00:43:25.220 Oh, you are not doing well. 00:43:29.010 --> 00:43:30.750 Whether something comes out of 00:43:30.750 --> 00:43:31.450 it, we do not know. 00:43:31.450 --> 00:43:32.891 The presumption of 00:43:32.891 --> 00:43:34.730 innocence also applies. 00:43:35.050 --> 00:43:36.671 For Liz, this was a very 00:43:36.671 --> 00:43:38.590 important moment. 00:43:44.410 --> 00:43:46.831 At the end of the day, she says 00:43:46.831 --> 00:43:48.610 again loudly and clearly that 00:43:49.530 --> 00:43:52.450 she wants to make a statement. 00:43:54.780 --> 00:43:56.921 When I said this phrase 00:43:56.921 --> 00:43:58.161 out loud in this very large 00:43:58.161 --> 00:44:00.160 building, it was 00:44:00.160 --> 00:44:02.920 my personal victory. 00:44:03.280 --> 00:44:04.641 This was the victory of my life. 00:44:04.641 --> 00:44:06.540 That was my Mount Everest. 00:44:51.760 --> 00:44:53.941 List of advisory and assistance 00:44:53.941 --> 00:44:55.840 offers for you. 00:44:55.900 --> 00:44:57.061 We put the link in the 00:44:57.061 --> 00:44:58.380 show notes. 00:44:58.380 --> 00:44:59.381 There you will also 00:44:59.381 --> 00:45:01.660 find further information about this. 00:45:02.780 --> 00:45:04.421 Toxic Tantra is a podcast 00:45:04.421 --> 00:45:06.501 by me Katja Peisen-Petersen 00:45:06.501 --> 00:45:07.701 and Christiane 00:45:07.701 --> 00:45:09.201 Havranek. 00:45:10.000 --> 00:45:11.580 Thank you to Verena Nierle 00:45:11.580 --> 00:45:13.461 and thank you to all who 00:45:13.461 --> 00:45:14.921 were in the yoga movement 00:45:14.921 --> 00:45:17.280 and had the courage to talk to us. 00:45:17.720 --> 00:45:20.280 Graphic design by Anna Hunger. 00:45:20.700 --> 00:45:23.200 Sound design by Christoph Brandner. 00:45:23.200 --> 00:45:25.280 Sound and Technique, Robin Ault. 00:45:25.540 --> 00:45:27.540 Directed by Ron Schickler. 00:45:27.540 --> 00:45:29.220 The author is Johannes 00:45:29.220 --> 00:45:31.200 Badaro-Willmann. 00:45:31.200 --> 00:45:32.361 Editorial, Pia 00:45:32.361 --> 00:45:33.941 Dangelmayer, Till Ottlitz and 00:45:33.941 --> 00:45:35.441 Sabine Winter. 00:45:35.680 --> 00:45:37.021 Toxic Tantra is a production 00:45:37.021 --> 00:45:38.341 of the editorial religion 00:45:38.341 --> 00:45:39.821 and orientation. 00:45:39.821 --> 00:45:42.081 The BR Research and 00:45:42.081 --> 00:45:43.741 the BR Story team 00:45:43.741 --> 00:45:45.321 for the Bavarian Broadcasting 00:45:45.321 --> 00:45:47.800 2024. 00:45:53.650 --> 00:45:54.891 We wanted to tell you 00:45:54.891 --> 00:45:56.231 about a podcast from 00:45:56.231 --> 00:45:58.530 Deutschlandfunk Nova that 00:45:58.530 --> 00:46:00.090 you might like. 00:46:00.110 --> 00:46:02.591 Mindfulness is about how to 00:46:02.591 --> 00:46:04.511 get more mindful, healthier and happier 00:46:04.511 --> 00:46:05.970 through life. 00:46:05.970 --> 00:46:07.211 The creators and the podcasts 00:46:07.211 --> 00:46:08.671 are presenting themselves. 00:46:08.671 --> 00:46:09.471 00:46:09.471 --> 00:46:11.471 Hi, hello, we are Dianne 00:46:11.471 --> 00:46:13.291 and Mayhorn and we talk 00:46:13.291 --> 00:46:14.871 about what we can do every 00:46:14.871 --> 00:46:17.010 week to make it get better. 00:46:17.010 --> 00:46:18.510 With mindfulness. 00:46:25.530 --> 00:46:27.931 So that means being completely 00:46:27.931 --> 00:46:29.130 in the here and now. 00:46:29.130 --> 00:46:31.011 Even when we wander around, when 00:46:31.011 --> 00:46:32.151 we are afraid, when we 00:46:32.151 --> 00:46:33.310 are worried. 00:46:33.310 --> 00:46:35.950 Simply feel and be there. 00:46:35.950 --> 00:46:37.071 So be here. 00:46:37.071 --> 00:46:39.250 It is not so easy. 00:46:39.250 --> 00:46:40.131 But the more often 00:46:40.131 --> 00:46:42.310 we do, the better we are. 00:46:42.310 --> 00:46:43.211 We present scientific 00:46:43.211 --> 00:46:44.491 studies every 00:46:44.491 --> 00:46:45.290 week. 00:46:45.290 --> 00:46:46.891 We do exercises, exchange 00:46:46.891 --> 00:46:49.031 our mindfulness practices, and 00:46:49.031 --> 00:46:51.130 somehow find solutions. 00:46:52.110 --> 00:46:53.591 And then, Maihong, let’ 00:46:53.591 --> 00:46:55.331 s look carefully at what’ 00:46:55.331 --> 00:46:56.070 s all there. 00:46:56.070 --> 00:46:57.070 I think you had a 00:46:57.070 --> 00:46:57.951 lot of fun in researching. 00:46:57.951 --> 00:46:58.930 00:46:58.930 --> 00:47:00.890 I had so much fun. 00:47:01.410 --> 00:47:02.711 And behind the scenes I 00:47:02.711 --> 00:47:04.011 have already told you, somehow 00:47:04.011 --> 00:47:05.651 every attentive sequence 00:47:05.651 --> 00:47:06.351 changes somehow my life 00:47:06.351 --> 00:47:07.831 and I have also tried a lot 00:47:07.831 --> 00:47:08.511 of things this time 00:47:08.511 --> 00:47:09.611 again so we train together 00:47:09.611 --> 00:47:12.491 each week we can be better 00:47:12.491 --> 00:47:14.391 attentive that is such 00:47:14.391 --> 00:47:16.011 a nice joint training 00:47:16.011 --> 00:47:18.171 we can carefully deal with 00:47:18.171 --> 00:47:19.311 our thoughts our feelings 00:47:19.311 --> 00:47:21.171 with pain and also 00:47:21.171 --> 00:47:23.691 with loss we can observe 00:47:23.691 --> 00:47:25.811 ourselves more carefully 00:47:25.811 --> 00:47:27.791 and learn what we need 00:47:27.791 --> 00:47:29.830 when then I 00:47:29.850 --> 00:47:33.230 say and beg. 00:47:34.100 --> 00:47:36.740 Be careful because it makes us healthy.